Im so tired of playing protoss

[Gearvosh]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

[Entropia]

You can counter with siege tanks and AA!

[Cellar]

My last 6 games were TvT. On the plus side now I know how to use vikings

[Gabtraf]

Eh I mostly play against Protoss and Terran, mostly protoss I don't see that many zerg out...

[Primoris]

In my experience most silver league toss players leave themselves particularly vulnerable to air. Banshee rush his econ, mop up with M&M.

[Gearvosh]

In my experience most silver league toss players leave themselves particularly vulnerable to air. Banshee rush his econ, mop up with M&M.

Seems like you didn't even read my post.

[Lagorathia]

you have to waste money on countering observers?? EGAADD I FEEL SO SORRY FOR YOU

[Primoris]

Seems like you didn't even read my post.

I read your post, seems your upset you got countered and did nothing to counter him.

[Krazytrumpet]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

So...he had a colossus by the time you had 7 t1 units? Hrm...

[Silent]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

I dl'ed and watched the entire replay.

It just seems like he out-played you. If we choose to take APM into account, his average (61ish) is twice yours. There's also a good period where you've got over 700 minerals and roughly 300-400 gas unspent (when you're retreating from his base). Additionally, I did not once see Calldown: Mule used; with that, plus the spare minerals you had, you probably could've just gone triple rax and mass pumped M&Ms with 2 existing Ghosts and hit him hard, even with his Colossus (thx Mr. EMP).

Given what you had, you actually did really well to stop all his Colossi, but it just looks like having that third rax or even just something else pumping offensive units could have (or would have?) pushed the fight in your favor - the Factory seems to have been... ignored completely after finishing it.

Technically, too, a Ghost's gas cost is the same as a Colossus's cost

[Crimson]

I dl'ed and watched the entire replay.

It just seems like he out-played you. If we choose to take APM into account, his average (61ish) is twice yours. There's also a good period where you've got over 700 minerals and roughly 300-400 gas unspent (when you're retreating from his base). Additionally, I did not once see Calldown: Mule used; with that, plus the spare minerals you had, you probably could've just gone triple rax and mass pumped M&Ms with 2 existing Ghosts and hit him hard, even with his Colossus (thx Mr. EMP).

Given what you had, you actually did really well to stop all his Colossi, but it just looks like having that third rax or even just something else pumping offensive units could have (or would have?) pushed the fight in your favor - the Factory seems to have been... ignored completely after finishing it.

Technically, too, a Ghost's gas cost is the same as a Colossus's cost

after watching i also agree here. you got out played but if you had been using the mule and keeping units coming you could of easily took the colossi down and hard.

[Stratosspear]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

Go out and actually play as Protoss, you'll see how much we have to do and what counters them.

[Gearvosh]

I dl'ed and watched the entire replay.

It just seems like he out-played you. If we choose to take APM into account, his average (61ish) is twice yours. There's also a good period where you've got over 700 minerals and roughly 300-400 gas unspent (when you're retreating from his base). Additionally, I did not once see Calldown: Mule used; with that, plus the spare minerals you had, you probably could've just gone triple rax and mass pumped M&Ms with 2 existing Ghosts and hit him hard, even with his Colossus (thx Mr. EMP).

Given what you had, you actually did really well to stop all his Colossi, but it just looks like having that third rax or even just something else pumping offensive units could have (or would have?) pushed the fight in your favor - the Factory seems to have been... ignored completely after finishing it.

Technically, too, a Ghost's gas cost is the same as a Colossus's cost

In the score screen our unit score were even, that wasn't really the problem. I was saving the vespene for ghost/medivacs, thats why I had it while I was waiting for my starport. Referring to the MULE, I was using my scanner sweep to see exactly what he was doing.

I like what you said here "Technically, too, a Ghost's gas cost is the same as a Colossus's cost". I think that kind of proves my point. He can have 3 giant colossi that decimate my infantry in 1 shot combined, while I get 3 ghosts that can only remove its shields.

I guess ill just try to pump more marines, but against colossi I dont see a point.

[Draemos]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

Go air. Banshee's and Vikings w/ Marauder support

[vulcan]

I play 'toss and I swear 90% of my games are against Zerg. 90% of these zerg go Muta and win as I prepare myself for a Roach rush (which I would also probably lose against)
@!%! sucks.

[Gearvosh]

Go air. Banshee's and Vikings w/ Marauder support

Why do people keep saying that? How am I even supposed to get banshees that early in the game, as well as getting ghosts and keeping enough infantry to defend?

[Pdc]

If he has observers, he has a robotics facility, which means you could have a star port.

The MULE will allow you to go gas earlier than you'd think allowing you to either tech faster or build up MM faster.

[Minos]

just get battlecruisers.

[Barcibus]

Maybe they could shave another 10 points from Zealots' shields for you.

[Fohobogah]

Ghost + Tanks\upgraded marine swarm are good collossus counter. Any air unit is good colossus counter.

But you're confusing though, you complaning about collossus rush, and then about warping ability, but you can't warp in colossus.
Now you probably are upset about the fact that he can warp in units in 5 sec at the last minute, allowing to stash more money in the process. But you're forgetting that any sizable warp in require a sizable amount of gates, one per unit per cooldown. They arejust trading off, each warpgate cost 150, is mostly useless(production wise) and REQUIRE you (to be usefull) to have enough money at ANY point to warp in those units in. You simply must expect that he will warp units in when you attack. So plan your attack accordingly! Long story short, WG ALLOWS you to stash more ressources but FORCES you to not spend it if you want to use the suprise effect. End line is you have the money ready, not more not less.

Always know the number of warpgate your enemy has, so you can better size his strenght. One WG=one unexpected unit. That's all, deal with it.

[samuel]

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in.

Any money? Protoss units are the most expensive units in the game.

[Frozen]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

Teching quick collosi is a huge investment of time and resources that are detracted from his current standing army. If you let it advance that far, you didn't MM rush when you saw him teching... assuming you scouted.

Ghosts are awesome, but I never build them cause I tech past them if MM don't cut it.

[Thato]

Ya making coll. is a big investment. Have to build the robotics then another building then start them. It leaves me gas starved and causes my standing army to be mostly zealots.

Translation: While trying to get my tech unit I'm generally weaker and very open to attack . Also, if you fooled my scout and made me think you went MMM and actually went banshee you just won.

[Draemos]

Why do people keep saying that? How am I even supposed to get banshees that early in the game, as well as getting ghosts and keeping enough infantry to defend?

If he has Colossus then you should be spitting out banshees. Banshee's are gas limited and have long build times, you can still support 2-3 rax off a single base. If he is fast teching to Colossus he isn't going to be able to push through your wall-in until its done.

He is teching to Colossus to beat your M&M rush. If you tech with him your air will be out in time to beat his Colossus rush.

If you still think its impossible to get air up that fast then you need to work on your build order.

[Gearvosh]

If he has Colossus then you should be spitting out banshees. Banshee's are gas limited and have long build times, you can still support 2-3 rax off a single base. If he is fast teching to Colossus he isn't going to be able to push through your wall-in until its done.

He is teching to Colossus to beat your M&M rush. If you tech with him your air will be out in time to beat his Colossus rush.

If you still think its impossible to get air up that fast then you need to work on your build order.

Or you know... I went the Ghost tech instead.

The game was only like 10 minutes long, Im not able to get both Banshee and Ghost.

[Kralic]

I would say going Vikings over Banshee's is the way to handle Collosi. 1-2 ghosts 1 starport with reactor and build 4-6 vikings with your ground force.

[Idkanything]

Wall in
Fast tech to banshee's and start harass
downshift to upgraded bio
MMM ball + banshee support (he's probably chasing them around with phoenixes at this point)

snipe colossi w/ banshees - get phoenixes with your marines, utilize stim.

This is a very good "generic" strat against toss - you obviously still need to scout to say counter a rush, or if they head to DT's instead but if you need a cookie cutter build that'll probably help you in any non high end plat games - this will probably take care of it for ya

[Gearvosh]

I would of been able to beat him with my push if I did it about 30 seconds earlier. I guess its just one of those games.

[Soli]

Less QQ moar PEW PEW!

Seriously though, your race has a skill that can wipe out an entire Protoss army's shields in one or two AOE casts and you *complain* about this as if it's a disadvantage? You're not making rational arguments, you're just whining about your bad strategy to build expensive counters to every single Protoss unit (seriously, you build enough turrets to slow you down noticeably just to counter observers?). Unless you have a coherent argument for what in particular is wrong besides you being bad... BTW Colossi cost 300/200 and are tier 3. It primarily counters mass tier one. Please explain again how horribly unfair that is? Scrub.

[Draemos]

Or you know... I went the Ghost tech instead.

The game was only like 10 minutes long, Im not able to get both Banshee and Ghost.

So change up your tech?

[Gearvosh]

Less QQ moar PEW PEW!

Seriously though, your race has a skill that can wipe out an entire Protoss army's shields in one or two AOE casts and you *complain* about this as if it's a disadvantage? You're not making rational arguments, you're just whining about your bad strategy to build expensive counters to every single Protoss unit (seriously, you build enough turrets to slow you down noticeably just to counter observers?). Unless you have a coherent argument for what in particular is wrong besides you being bad... BTW Colossi cost 300/200 and are tier 3. It primarily counters mass tier one. Please explain again how horribly unfair that is? Scrub.

Tier 3? Your argument just turned invalid.

[engineer]

Or you know... I went the Ghost tech instead.

The game was only like 10 minutes long, Im not able to get both Banshee and Ghost.

The solution is simple. Get banshees before ghosts. You don't need EMP when your units can attack with impunity.

I'm not trying to offend you, but it seems like you're complaining that you need to change your strategy based on your opponent's play. This is the whole point of an RTS game. If you could make the same build and win every time, it would be kind of lame.

[Mnijykmirl]

My last 6 games were TvT. On the plus side now I know how to use vikings

This.

I can play 10 games against Toss or Zerg and be happy.
TvT on the other hand is just crazy.

[Scorcher]

Your rush hit him about 7:20 into the game. At 7:30, I can have 2 banshees out and in-route to his mineral line w/ 2 more in the pipe and 6-8 marines behind my wall for token defense. He had one stalker. Would have been gg.

If you want to feel a little better (or worse, depending on your league/rank), moongoddess was in my division (Bronze #8), shot from placement to #1 in about 2 days, got promoted out. Obviously a decent toss player, after he figured out the race.

Also, right before you rushed, you scanned the area above the rocks. If you'd instead scanned his main base, you'd have known what you were coming up against and could have beelined for the robotics facility. Might have had a chance then, at the least stopped the colossus from completing.

[Streetwise]

Two words, better macro. That is what you need. There is no way he already had a colosus out when you only had 5 marines 2 mauraders unless you are just terribly slow. A tip? Watch some replays of better players and learn how to build an army faster.

[Crazyterran]

Really? My games usually are;

Zerg
Terran
Terran
Terran
Zerg
Protoss
Protoss
Zerg
Zerg
Zerg
Terran...
Random.

Then again, I'm in the lower brackets, where every monkey is going zerg for 'lolroaches/zerglings'

[Nataku]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

keep them scouted, if you see that hes going col, attack him, dont not scout and be suprised when he gets col. and warping in an army is 1 gate per warpin and its got like 10-15 sec cooldown between each warp, so unless hes got like 3-4 gates (even at that, thats onlt 3-4 units every 10-15 sec) fear of a warp in when you hae an army there is null.


Then again, I'm in the lower brackets, where every monkey is going zerg for 'lolroaches/zerglings'

every once in awhile ill mas lings, and i make a den incase im being rushed, but i normaly quick tech to the end-most hydra... they are pretty sick. only twice have i been truely countered with them, and the zerg that did it was really good, using speed and mobility of muta to harass me from all over and finaly used mass lings as fodder for muta to kill me... second was i was medivacked with tanks and marines as i was making hydra... it was pretty retarded how fast he got them

[BeL]

Dude. Banshees take the same tech to get out as colossus.

Don't forget that colossus requires a DEDICATED BUILDING.

[Wyrd]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

The easiest counter to collossi are a few vikings. 3 or 4 are enough to beat back most collossi attacks, especially if you keep them on high ground where stalkers have trouble getting to them.

Failing that, 4 or 5 siege tanks will take out a collossi in a single volley. Scout, and if you see collossi, either of those will pretty much make his collossi wasted resources.

Both of those options should be available to you around the time he will be bringing the collossi.

[Kuramabingyi]

About 90% of my games are against protoss, and its the same %!*! every time. The same damn strats I have to play against. I just played a game where I rushed with about 5 marines and 2 marauders and he already had a colossus out and it countered me. What the hell is that.

Its so dumb playing terran against protoss because you have to:

- Waste money on turrets because they always send like 3 observers at you (bull%!*! map control always)
- Tech up to ghosts for EMP which in turn doesn't allow you to get medivacs as quickly or use much of any factory units

So now your stuck with infantry and they just get completely worked by early colossi. Heres the replay. Our score were pretty even, about 5k difference, but he was simply able to walk over me with colossi. He only beat me in resources because he expanded right at the end.

And another thing I hate about protoss, is they dont have to spend ANY money on units and can tech like crazy because of warp in. Once they are under attack they can simply warp in for an instant army (not in this replay).

Seriously, how am I supposed to counter early colossi if ghosts cost so god damn much vespene.

Replay: http://www.mediafire.com/download.php?mjyemjygzzm

I started off massing Marines and then tech'd up to get Battlecruisers with the Yamato Cannon against the Protoss. Ended up winning in forty-five minutes. My base was well-defended with Anti-Air emplacements and a #@*#-load of BC. A good majority of my Marines were killed, but I ended up just storming the place (the player's mistake was to destroy the rocks outside of his base in Burning Sands) with everything I had - Marines, Marauders, and Battlecruisers. 67 units total.