View Full Version : Nerf Roach or dont sell this game
Brave
03-18-2010, 06:41 PM
the title say everything, protoss cant do anything vs roach, thats it.
Fdsdfg
03-18-2010, 06:42 PM
Protoss has the easiest time of the 3 races dealing with Roach. Pretty simple one here: l2p
Elixir
03-18-2010, 06:43 PM
This is the most constructive and informative post I have ever read.
+1
Twatllama
03-18-2010, 06:44 PM
I have never had a problem against roaches.. I make stalkers, I make walkers, gg. It think Protoss should be a bit nerfed actually, their C command from Nexus (I don't know names, I know hotkeys) makes them rush their techs much faster than other races.
Yes...protoss can. It's called stalkers and immortals when you see a roach warren. Blizzard already said they're watching roaches.
I have never had a problem against roaches.. I make stalkers, I make walkers, gg. It think Protoss should be a bit nerfed actually, their C command from Nexus (I don't know names, I know hotkeys) makes them rush their techs much faster than other races.
If you don't even know unit/ability names, you probably aren't qualified to comment on balance...just sayin'
If you don't even know unit/ability names, you probably aren't qualified to comment on balance...just sayin'
Could probably say the same about you Mr. Gold.
Slayersav
03-18-2010, 06:48 PM
Your obviously new to the game because there is plenty toss can do to counter roaches. Terran is by far the easiest to take care of and take out early game if they dont know what there doing. Protoss can easily defend.
You notice how everyone complains about the race they don't play? Try playing all 3 races and do the beta some good. Just because you dont win every time doesn't mean its a problem with a game it could be your skill vs the opponents skill.
Im not saying you suck, Im not saying im better than you. Im saying practice. Think up a solid argument and go from there.
With that being said people need to stop complaining and try every aspect of the game what counters what and which units are best for doing certain things.
Now my point of view. I would make roaches cost a little more maybe.. but with the recent nerfs things need to be taken into consideration.
You realize that a Roach rush which i can attack about 4:30-5 min into game.. they only attack ground. Protoss can Void Ray rush.. all it takes is is a few and the most you will fight is a queen.
Try it. works every time. Toss can get void rays as fast as zerg gets roaches.. dont believe me? play me.
Stratosspear
03-18-2010, 06:49 PM
I have never had a problem against roaches.. I make stalkers, I make walkers, gg. It think Protoss should be a bit nerfed actually, their C command from Nexus (I don't know names, I know hotkeys) makes them rush their techs much faster than other races.
I'm sorry, but you're just flat out wrong. Protoss is probably the weakest race right now.
Protoss has the easiest time of the 3 races dealing with Roach. Pretty simple one here: l2p
No, Marauders are the best unit in the game at slaughtering Roaches. Protoss do fair pretty well once they get Immortals/Colossi though.
Try it. works every time. Toss can get void rays as fast as zerg gets roaches.. dont believe me? play me.
While the rest of your post is ok, this is just...no. A Roach Warren requires a Spawning Pool and 150 minerals. That's it. After that you can immediately make Roaches which cost less and produce faster than Void Rays.
Void Rays by comparison require a Gateway, a Cybernetics Core, and a Stargate (150 minerals/100 gas). Void Rays also cost longer and take more time to get out.
There is no way you can get out Void Rays at the same time Roaches are popping. I'm fairly confident in saying it's mathematically impossible.
Could probably say the same about you Mr. Gold.
I know the names. and I was dropped from 1200 platinum to 860 gold after a WIN. I have since elevated it from 860 to 1500+.
nice try.
Droodjerky
03-18-2010, 06:51 PM
I do not understand at all how to get past Roaches. I try Hellion harass and they block the ramp and have a spine crawler at their expo (always get a damn expo).
I try MM and I can't break the expo or put sufficient pressure on to stop a 2nd expo, thus I fall further behind and get owned.
I try to get Banshees and I'm owned by Mutalisks.
I try expanding myself only to be out massed by people with 1/4th my apm.
If I do succeed at expanding once, the zerg has such a huge force from lack of pressure that they have a 3rd and I can't do anything.
I can't do enough economic damage/harass to a Zerg to stop them from out massing me. Zerg is SCREWED vs Terran.
the title say everything, protoss cant do anything vs roach, thats it.
Dogbert's Clues for the Clueless: Protoss versus Roaches.
You see, your nexus has this ability that lets your bulidings and units do the "time warp"...it's called "Chrono boost"...pump drones until you need more pylons, then have one probe go around and build (quick, like a bunny!) A Pylon, A gateway, An Assimilator, A cybernetics core, And a robotics facility. If you have enough minerals while one of these is still "cooking" put out a forge too. Use the pylon and the gateway to block your ramp.
Also, make one more probe and send it to scout the enemy camp. You want to see if he has a roach warren...if he does, then keep going on this path. If he doesn't you should probably still do so, since zergling rushes are still nasty.
As soon as the Gateway is in play, start making Zealots. Just chronoboost the gateway as often as you can and make zealots as fast as you can. Don't build the buildings I mentioned earlier if your gateway isn't making a zealot., and again, don't make a forge until you have the robotic facility. If you do it right, by the time the zerg gets his first few Roaches knocking on your door, youi'll have enough zealots to deal with them long enouhg for your RF to be completed.
Then you make 2 or 3 immortals, up the zealots with them, and laugh as the roaches are squished like the annoying bugs they are. After that, you're on youir own.
Now protoss buildings can't really "blocK" a ramp, but they can funnel incominbg zerg. Once you have a robotic facility, you can build a warp prism to transport your units past the barrier anyway.
Zerothgal
03-18-2010, 06:53 PM
Dogbert's Clues for the Clueless: Protoss versus Roaches.
You see, your nexus has this ability that lets your bulidings and units do the "time warp"...it's called "Chrono boost"...pump drones until you need more pylons, then have one probe go around and build (quick, like a bunny!) A Pylon, A gateway, An Assimilator, A cybernetics core, And a robotics facility. If you have enough minerals while one of these is still "cooking" put out a forge too. Use the pylon and the gateway to block your ramp.
Also, make one more probe and send it to scout the enemy camp. You want to see if he has a roach warren...if he does, then keep going on this path. If he doesn't you should probably still do so, since zergling rushes are still nasty.
As soon as the Gateway is in play, start making Zealots. Just chronoboost the gateway as often as you can and make zealots as fast as you can. Don't build the buildings I mentioned earlier if your gateway isn't making a zealot., and again, don't make a forge until you have the robotic facility. If you do it right, by the time the zerg gets his first few Roaches knocking on your door, youi'll have enough zealots to deal with them long enouhg for your RF to be completed.
Then you make 2 or 3 immortals, up the zealots with them, and laugh as the roaches are squished like the annoying bugs they are. After that, you're on youir own.
Now protoss buildings can't really "blocK" a ramp, but they can funnel incominbg zerg. Once you have a robotic facility, you can build a warp prism to transport your units past the barrier anyway.
Don't forget the Force Fields from the Sentries, which actually can block of a ramp entirely (provided that you're on a map with one of course).
I'm terran and I'm fine with roaches.
Poolatka
03-18-2010, 06:55 PM
ok, roaches sucked when i first picked up the beta.
you know if you're playing against zerg they will probably get roaches....get ready for it.
I'm terran and I'm fine with roaches.
Well Terrans brought their bug spray...in the form of splash from seige tanks and hellions, and of course bunkers, which can focus fire now...yay!
Pertinacious
03-18-2010, 06:57 PM
ROACHES MAKE ME SO ANGRY I'M CONSTIPATED!
WE MUST MAKE MORE THREADS ABOUT ROACHES!
ROACHES BOINKED MY SISTER AND RAN OVER MY DOG!
I'm sorry, but you're just flat out wrong. Protoss is probably the weakest race right now.
No, Marauders are the best unit in the game at slaughtering Roaches. Protoss do fair pretty well once they get Immortals/Colossi though.
While the rest of your post is ok, this is just...no. A Roach Warren requires a Spawning Pool and 150 minerals. That's it. After that you can immediately make Roaches which cost less and produce faster than Void Rays.
Void Rays by comparison require a Gateway, a Cybernetics Core, and a Stargate (150 minerals/100 gas). Void Rays also cost longer and take more time to get out.
There is no way you can get out Void Rays at the same time Roaches are popping. I'm fairly confident in saying it's mathematically impossible.
Marauders are good at killing roaches, but immortals are better. An immortal can take on like 5 at once and win. Thats about as hard a counter as it gets. A marauder can take on 1 at once and maybe win.
Instructions...........
1. Pick up large baseball bat known as the "NERF BAT"
2. Move to Roaches.
3. Proceed to beat them.
4. Thank Blizzard.
Chasm
03-18-2010, 07:00 PM
the title say everything, protoss cant do anything vs roach, thats it. This is the most dramatic post I have ever read lol gj.
anywase immortals *%%% roaches...
Acrowley
03-18-2010, 07:01 PM
Well, OP has a point. Roaches are pretty dang powerful. Compare them to just about any other early game unit, especially for their price. Are they SOOO powerful they are ruining the game? No. Are they too good a deal for their price and being tier 1, and how many you can get so fast? Probably. That's why you see most zerg players skipping zerglings and banelings. Zerglings and banelings DO NOT suck, but the roach is just too good a deal to pass up. Way too good a deal. I really think the answer to the roach is lowering it's damage a bit. Let the zerg depend on variety, becuase believe me, zerglings and banelings can do a TON of damage, and roaches are there to soak up hits, which they can do with all that health and armor. Drop their damage just a bit, and we have a solution everyone *should* be happy with. Yes, I know it will tick some people off to have to build a variety instead of just massing 1 thing, but It's in the name of balance.
Libtech
03-18-2010, 07:02 PM
Take a breather after losing a game to zerg, or don't post on the forums.
Smigi
03-18-2010, 07:03 PM
I'm sorry, but you're just flat out wrong. Protoss is probably the weakest race right now.
No, Marauders are the best unit in the game at slaughtering Roaches. Protoss do fair pretty well once they get Immortals/Colossi though.
While the rest of your post is ok, this is just...no. A Roach Warren requires a Spawning Pool and 150 minerals. That's it. After that you can immediately make Roaches which cost less and produce faster than Void Rays.
Void Rays by comparison require a Gateway, a Cybernetics Core, and a Stargate (150 minerals/100 gas). Void Rays also cost longer and take more time to get out.
There is no way you can get out Void Rays at the same time Roaches are popping. I'm fairly confident in saying it's mathematically impossible.
Protoss is the weakest race right now? Please tell me your source? I'm sure you don't have one, because its not true.
Dustin Browder just said in an interview that Terran is right now statistically the weakest race.
Please don't just speak, use your head before you do it.
DarkOne
03-18-2010, 07:04 PM
the title say everything, protoss cant do anything vs roach, thats it.
I do not agree here, for the protoss easily can defend against roachs if you know what to counter them with. I have played as both and seen how easily protoss can stop a roach bombardment and then make a fast retaliation against the zerg for a quick win.
Wintermute
03-18-2010, 07:05 PM
Well, OP has a point. Roaches are pretty dang powerful. Compare them to just about any other early game unit, especially for their price. Are they SOOO powerful they are ruining the game? No. Are they too good a deal for their price and being tier 1, and how many you can get so fast? Probably. That's why you see most zerg players skipping zerglings and banelings. Zerglings and banelings DO NOT suck, but the roach is just too good a deal to pass up. Way too good a deal. I really think the answer to the roach is lowering it's damage a bit. Let the zerg depend on variety, becuase believe me, zerglings and banelings can do a TON of damage, and roaches are there to soak up hits, which they can do with all that health and armor. Drop their damage just a bit, and we have a solution everyone *should* be happy with. Yes, I know it will tick some people off to have to build a variety instead of just massing 1 thing, but It's in the name of balance.
Roaches already do damage comparable to a zergling at 4x the cost. You can lower it further but at some point roaches serve no purpose except to literally stand in choke points and block passage.
In response to "zerglings don't suck." Well, they don't suck, but if you mass lings and your opponent masses marines or zealots, you'll lose. It's only during the early stages of the game when people are operating out of one or two gateways or barracks that you can flood them with enough lings to truly overwhelm. Later on, zerglings mainly serve as a way to get more damage on a target (lings, roaches and hydras all have different range, so they work well together) or to circle and trap.
Zerglings are not bad, but they are not a mainstay unit, and without tier 1 hydralisks, zerg would be easily crushed by marine or zealot pushes in the early game.
Velvethero
03-18-2010, 07:06 PM
the title say everything, protoss cant do anything vs roach, thats it.
Wtf are you talking about? All I play i toss and half the games agaisnt zerg they go roaches and it could not be easier to deal with. Once the roaches fail they always goto muta, which poses a challenge.
Guesswho
03-18-2010, 07:07 PM
When I play zerg all I worry about are fast Lings or Mass Mutas. Roaches are a fact of life, and a properly build base will hold them off until Immortals show up.
Sonofsamus
03-18-2010, 07:08 PM
the title say everything, protoss cant do anything vs roach, thats it.
Umm, shouldn't it be more like "nerf roach or I won't buy this game". Telling Blizz not to sell it is like saying, if you sell it and people buy it then I will have been wrong about nerfing roaches and will have lost my nerd cred.
Vexorian
03-18-2010, 07:09 PM
Roaches already do damage comparable to a zergling at 4x the cost. That's silly, 4 zerglings won't last as much as a roach...
Tojara
03-18-2010, 07:10 PM
The only people crying about Roaches should be Zerg. ZvZ Rogue fests suck.
Roach crying as protoss is comical at best. If he's going Roaches quick tech to Immortals. One Immortal absolutely *%*@s 4-5 Roaches.
TBH, Zerg Tier1 would have issues if Roaches were nerfed. Maybe some very minor change, like slightly less HP, or 2 less damage, etc, but anything major would be bad.
I think im going to quit the forum. There is so much ignorance it makes me sick. Like the guy earlier in the post that said terran brought their bug spray in the form of siege tanks and hellions. Have you ever used a hellion against a roach? Have you ever used 12 hellions against a roach?
This thread fails.
Its not the roach, its the queen
build an immortal
Disastorm
03-18-2010, 07:13 PM
I'm sorry, but you're just flat out wrong. Protoss is probably the weakest race right now.
The stats say different. At the high levels, Protoss has the highest win rate in the US and is the most players in Asia. In US, Asia, and Europe, T has the lowest win rate.
Jwray
03-18-2010, 07:14 PM
Roaches get !%#*d by mass marauders from terrans, and get owned by immortals a little bit later from the protoss. 2 zealots properly positioned can hold off over 9000 zerglings while you fast tech to immortals and chrono boost the build.
Wyndrunner
03-18-2010, 07:15 PM
You realize that a Roach rush which i can attack about 4:30-5 min into game.. they only attack ground. Protoss can Void Ray rush.. all it takes is is a few and the most you will fight is a queen.
Try it. works every time. Toss can get void rays as fast as zerg gets roaches.. dont believe me? play me.
This is very true. If you go straight to a heavy roach rush against a protoss who is good, they will rush to void rays and destroy your lair and you're screwed. A roach rush has to be done very well to win against an experienced player.
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